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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 12, 2011 17:59:44 GMT -5
I have been loving this.
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VorteX
Experienced Member
Stay a while...and listen.
Posts: 723
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Post by VorteX on Jul 12, 2011 18:06:58 GMT -5
I'm yes and no on it. Yes, it's entertaining and really what wrestling has been missing for quite some time (actual character gimmicks), however Sting goes way too overboard with it. If he'd tone it done out of Jim Carry territory it'd be great.
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Post by Silencio/The Dan on Jul 15, 2011 9:46:30 GMT -5
I'm yes and no on it. Yes, it's entertaining and really what wrestling has been missing for quite some time (actual character gimmicks), however Sting goes way too overboard with it. If he'd tone it done out of Jim Carry territory it'd be great. The funny thing is when I first saw this I thought "Why is he talking like Jim Carrey from "The Mask"?" instead of thinking about the Joker
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Post by Brian Bravado (Jonny Hughes) on Jul 15, 2011 16:27:49 GMT -5
Has anyone seen the guy who claims TNA have been ripping him off with this gimmick and Crimson's name?
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TJ
Experienced Member
I LOVE DAN WHITE
Good, you're working out Freeman....you're gonna need to
Posts: 848
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Post by TJ on Jul 16, 2011 3:48:41 GMT -5
SPOLIERS!!!!!!!!! Annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why I can't get behind TNA....this is your world champion? Sting's been around the block a couple times so he should know that he shouldn't be the champion for the simple fact that he isn't the future of the company, or even the present. They had a babyface champion who was the total package for TNA in Anderson, and they turn him heel after killing his momentum with a clean loss over fucking GUNNER! GUNNER! A GUY WHO THREE WEEKS EARLIER WAS FIGHTING OVER THE FUCKING TV TITLE! AND LOOK AT THE TV TITLE NOW! And watch them fuck up Austin Aries AGAIN! TNA needs to learn how to build off of things. The only thing they can build is Sting's world title count.
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Post by Brian Bravado (Jonny Hughes) on Jul 16, 2011 9:38:42 GMT -5
Austin Aries was golden on Impact. His exchange with Alex Shelley was funny.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 16, 2011 10:30:08 GMT -5
Annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why I can't get behind TNA....this is your world champion? Sting's been around the block a couple times so he should know that he shouldn't be the champion for the simple fact that he isn't the future of the company, or even the present. They had a babyface champion who was the total package for TNA in Anderson, and they turn him heel after killing his momentum with a clean loss over fucking GUNNER! GUNNER! A GUY WHO THREE WEEKS EARLIER WAS FIGHTING OVER THE FUCKING TV TITLE! AND LOOK AT THE TV TITLE NOW! And watch them fuck up Austin Aries AGAIN! TNA needs to learn how to build off of things. The only thing they can build is Sting's world title count. There is this belief on the internet in the wrestling circles that your world champion should be the young guy who will remain a top star in the company for the long-term. Wrong. Your world champion is the guy who sells the most tickets and draws the most interest, period. Right now Sting is doing that for TNA. He is keeping most of their current fans happy. Those who never watch and bitch, well, they will continue to keep bitching. When the Undertaker comes back from hibernation and claims titles, he does not draw as much ire because the IWC does not have a target on him. Why? He has always been a WWF guy so he gets a free pass. Sting is from WCW, and the original IWC loathed WCW. Today's IWC is made up of kids who hate it as well, but they never saw a show. It is just "cool" to rag on it. Also, Anderson was NOT a babyface. And you are the first person to say they "fucked up Austin Aries again." I see you can't get behind TNA. I would point out their good accomplishments but I would be wasting my time. As far as who watches TNA, or will watch in the future, I have come to the realization of a few common truths: People who do not like wrestling won't watch it. Why when you can watch cool things like "Glee." IWC smarks won't watch it. Not enough high school gyms and bingo halls. WWE marks won't watch it. Not enough production value. Flashing lights and giant screens are pretty. Only fans of "wrestling" will watch it. Wrestling does not lend itself well to our now "oh-so-cynical" society. The fact there are still around 1.5 million of us is impressive.
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Post by The Mainerishi on Jul 16, 2011 10:55:22 GMT -5
Annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why I can't get behind TNA....this is your world champion? Sting's been around the block a couple times so he should know that he shouldn't be the champion for the simple fact that he isn't the future of the company, or even the present. They had a babyface champion who was the total package for TNA in Anderson, and they turn him heel after killing his momentum with a clean loss over fucking GUNNER! GUNNER! A GUY WHO THREE WEEKS EARLIER WAS FIGHTING OVER THE FUCKING TV TITLE! AND LOOK AT THE TV TITLE NOW! And watch them fuck up Austin Aries AGAIN! TNA needs to learn how to build off of things. The only thing they can build is Sting's world title count. There is this belief on the internet in the wrestling circles that your world champion should be the young guy who will remain a top star in the company for the long-term. Wrong. Your world champion is the guy who sells the most tickets and draws the most interest, period. Right now Sting is doing that for TNA. He is keeping most of their current fans happy. Those who never watch and bitch, well, they will continue to keep bitching. When the Undertaker comes back from hibernation and claims titles, he does not draw as much ire because the IWC does not have a target on him. Why? He has always been a WWF guy so he gets a free pass. Sting is from WCW, and the original IWC loathed WCW. Today's IWC is made up of kids who hate it as well, but they never saw a show. It is just "cool" to rag on it. Also, Anderson was NOT a babyface. And you are the first person to say they "fucked up Austin Aries again." I see you can't get behind TNA. I would point out their good accomplishments but I would be wasting my time. As far as who watches TNA, or will watch in the future, I have come to the realization of a few common truths: People who do not like wrestling won't watch it. Why when you can watch cool things like "Glee." IWC smarks won't watch it. Not enough high school gyms and bingo halls. WWE marks won't watch it. Not enough production value. Flashing lights and giant screens are pretty. Only fans of "wrestling" will watch it. Wrestling does not lend itself well to our now "oh-so-cynical" society. The fact there are still around 1.5 million of us is impressive. I like wrestling, I just don't like the direction that the company has taken. If Metallica had actually accepted Hulk Hogan to be their new bassist, TNA would be massively different to what it is now and the sad thing is, it could be so much better. In a time when WWE's product was lacklustre (Cena as champion for the best part of 2 years, anyone? Batista for God's sake?) there was a new buzz going on. Everyone was talking about these three letters that weren't WWE. "T", "N", and "A". And I was like what, "Test and Albert? What've they got to do with anything?" and they said "No no, Total Nonstop Action, it's this new amazing wrestling company". So, out of sheer curiosity I tuned into TNA for the first time. I watched a one hour episode of TNA and felt more entertained in those sixty minutes then I had by the majority of WWE programming in all of the WWE programming I'd seen since Wrestlemania 21 (excluding Mania 22, which was fucking metal, my favourite Mania ever, just saying). After that hour I was amazed by what I'd seen. I became a regular viewer. I couldn't believe it. World champions that did more than five moves? High-Fliers that were actually used? ACTUAL TAG TEAMS THAT DIDN'T SUCK?! It truly was a breath of fresh air. The argument that real, actual wrestling doesn't put asses in seats compared to star power and charisma is really irrelevant at this stage because during this golden era with matches like Ultimate X, Samoa Joe VS AJ Styles VS Christopher Daniels, Alex Shelley and The Papparazzi Production, Hail Sabin and Hell, even the days when Abyss and James Mitchell were making people shit themselves in ways that Undertaker hadn't been able to do since the Ministry Days it was obvious that this new buzz, TNA actually had both. All of this WAS putting asses in seats, as it got me and thousands more people watching each and every week. The occasional shot at WWE was inspiring, it was uncommon at that time for feds to take shots as other companies. It was amazing, especially for someone who had never experienced the Monday Night Wars. Then they went to two hours which at first went well, but instead of usng the opportunity to showcase more stars they just started pumping more filler segments and crap in rather than actual wrestling and so the product which was originally an hour long adrenaline rush became diluted and less entertaining. And then? When Hulk Hogan came along, things started to go south. The oversaturation of titles. When it had just three titles, the NWA World, Tag and X-Division titles it was great. The titles meant something. Then came the Knockouts Title, I could live with that as the women's wrestling was actually okay at this point. Then came three more titles that nobody cares about and bam, things went south from there on. Stories became more and more convoluted and stupid. Samoa Joe got kidnapped by ninja's and the whole product was just wasting away. They scrapped the one thing that made TNA unique to almost every wrestling promotion in the world in the six sided ring. Then they started with these stupid stable storylines like the Main Event Mafia and Immortal and Fourtune and all this other crap started happening that I stopped caring about. Then the X-Division got neglected because high-flying, high risk, adrenaline racing, entertaining action that makes people go "Holy Shit! How does he do that?!" apparently doesn't put asses in seats. Don't get me wrong Kiss, I know you hate boring indy guys who only do backflips and prefer meatheads but lets face it, early TNA had some amazingly charasmatic talent that could do the backflips too and that high risk atmosphere is far more exciting then headlocks and the same six moves. Nobody turned up to Evil Kinevil shows because they knew he'd be fine at the end of it. And while I'm not a massive fan of Sting, I can appreciate that he's a veteran and he has a lot of fans. However, this Joker gimmick is just bad. He's not right to play it. They should've given it to someone who can pull the gimmick off actually in the ring, someone who was a little bit faster and could ham up that psychopath thing through in-ring psychology. Instead we have a respected veteran trying to play a comic book super villain and it just comes off as terrible.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 16, 2011 11:11:40 GMT -5
The argument that real, actual wrestling doesn't put asses in seats compared to star power and charisma is really irrelevant at this stage because during this golden era with matches like Ultimate X, Samoa Joe VS AJ Styles VS Christopher Daniels, Alex Shelley and The Papparazzi Production, Hail Sabin and Hell, even the days when Abyss and James Mitchell were making people shit themselves in ways that Undertaker hadn't been able to do since the Ministry Days it was obvious that this new buzz, TNA actually had both. All of this WAS putting asses in seats, as it got me and thousands more people watching each and every week. The occasional shot at WWE was inspiring, it was uncommon at that time for feds to take shots as other companies. It was amazing, especially for someone who had never experienced the Monday Night Wars. Ratings have averaged the same during the time period you liked, and now. And for most people who dislike TNA, they have always disliked TNA. It has always sucked for them, pre-Hogan. There have been some fans lost, sure, but as a whole most people who dislike TNA disliked it far before Hogan showed up. Hogan just was the icing on the cake for the haters, as he is the pinnacle of hatred within the IWC.
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TJ
Experienced Member
I LOVE DAN WHITE
Good, you're working out Freeman....you're gonna need to
Posts: 848
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Post by TJ on Jul 17, 2011 23:14:46 GMT -5
There is this belief on the internet in the wrestling circles that your world champion should be the young guy who will remain a top star in the company for the long-term. Wrong. Your world champion is the guy who sells the most tickets and draws the most interest, period. Right now Sting is doing that for TNA. He is keeping most of their current fans happy. Those who never watch and bitch, well, they will continue to keep bitching. When the Undertaker comes back from hibernation and claims titles, he does not draw as much ire because the IWC does not have a target on him. Why? He has always been a WWF guy so he gets a free pass. Sting is from WCW, and the original IWC loathed WCW. Today's IWC is made up of kids who hate it as well, but they never saw a show. It is just "cool" to rag on it. Also, Anderson was NOT a babyface. And you are the first person to say they "fucked up Austin Aries again." I see you can't get behind TNA. I would point out their good accomplishments but I would be wasting my time. As far as who watches TNA, or will watch in the future, I have come to the realization of a few common truths: People who do not like wrestling won't watch it. Why when you can watch cool things like "Glee." IWC smarks won't watch it. Not enough high school gyms and bingo halls. WWE marks won't watch it. Not enough production value. Flashing lights and giant screens are pretty. Only fans of "wrestling" will watch it. Wrestling does not lend itself well to our now "oh-so-cynical" society. The fact there are still around 1.5 million of us is impressive. So because I talk about wrestling on the internet, it makes me a hiveminded-TNA-bashing smark.....right. It's not like I watched TNA since 2003 when they were on PPV only every wednesday night when the channel was just static, but the audio came in clear so I listen to West and Tenay (Who I thought was the owner because it sounded like TNA) call the action. It wasn't like I watched TNA when it went to FSN. It wasn't like I bought tickets to Lethal Lockdown a year or two ago when they came to Philly, and it's not like I'm not gonna buy tickets this week for Bound for Glory since TNA is coming back to Philly. So yes, I hate TNA and always will. When WWE does that with Taker, I bash it just as much. He doesn't need the title. I don't mind either of them being in the title picture, in fact, when Taker came back after Summerslam and feuded with Kane, I was hoping Kane would kick his ass and Taker never touch it, and Kane did which was great because Kane never got the best of him. So you're going to tell me that feuding, yelling, and threating the biggest group of heels, doesn't make you a face? Please, with your knowledge of everything wrestling related, tell me what does. He feuded with Immortal from the start of Immortal till he joined it. He flirted with the turn a couple weeks before he won the belt. I can get behind TNA, I was behind TNA from 08 to Genesis of this year. Between the copy and paste cards, poor booking, and momentum killing they did, I couldn't really be entertained by it. I'm not gonna watch TNA or buy the PPVs just because. People are entertained by TNA and that's good. It's just that they aren't consistent. I watch Impact and the first hour will be good and then the second won't be. The problem with TNA is they don't know who they are. Sometimes they think they are WWE, sometimes they think they are WCW, but when they think they are TNA, they are good. [youtube}http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swXqxG_G3fE&feature=relmfu[/youtube] Just one example of TNA when it's good. There are others, but this is my favorite moment.
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VorteX
Experienced Member
Stay a while...and listen.
Posts: 723
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Post by VorteX on Jul 17, 2011 23:46:12 GMT -5
I haven't liked TNA since 06 TBQH. From the FSN days up to early/mid 06 TNA was miles ahead of the WWE. Now, it's just a joke.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 18, 2011 0:17:56 GMT -5
So you're going to tell me that feuding, yelling, and threating the biggest group of heels, doesn't make you a face? Please, with your knowledge of everything wrestling related, tell me what does. He feuded with Immortal from the start of Immortal till he joined it. He flirted with the turn a couple weeks before he won the belt. WHY CERTAINLY I DID THAT, OH WISE MAN FROM PHILADELPHIA. Did you happen the miss the part where he mocked, berated and impersonated the babyface of the company? OH YEAH, THAT MAKES YOU A FACE, ALRIGHT! Or how about in March when he beat up the same babyface, Sting, on stage. Yes, Babyfaces do that! Or how about the various times he used Immortal for personal gain, before joining them. The guy was a complete Tweener, and this is noted as his stance for the last few months on wiki (inb4 WIKI PEIDA DUN COUNT). As for the rest of what you typed, good for you, age is more important in determining a champion rather than how entertaining someone is. Cool.
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Jason Freeman
Competition Judge
Long Island Iced Free
Posts: 3,271
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Post by Jason Freeman on Jul 18, 2011 17:26:09 GMT -5
Anderson WAS a face, just an anti-hero type face (like Thunderkiss) until he started attacking Sting and dressing up as him, which is about when he made the transition.
And yes the ratings are the same now, but now they have Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy, Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Eric Bischoff, etc, and that's gotta cost a lot of money so Id assume the are actually worse off then better
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 18, 2011 22:30:24 GMT -5
Anderson WAS a face, just an anti-hero type face (like Thunderkiss) until he started attacking Sting and dressing up as him, which is about when he made the transition. And yes the ratings are the same now, but now they have Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy, Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Eric Bischoff, etc, and that's gotta cost a lot of money so Id assume the are actually worse off then better TJ said in his original post that Anderson was turned heel after his losses with Gunner. No. He was not a face during the entire Sting contest, he was not a face much of the time previous considering he also attacked Sting and used others such as Immortal for his person gain. Also, you used my "anti-hero" to draw similarities to being a face. No, they are not the same, as I said, it is being a tweener. Not good, nor bad.
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Jason Freeman
Competition Judge
Long Island Iced Free
Posts: 3,271
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Post by Jason Freeman on Jul 19, 2011 16:15:29 GMT -5
Anderson was definitely a face when feuding with Hardy, and then after that he was mostly feuding with Bischoff and Hogan to get his rematch for his title. He was a face then clearly. Then he began feuding with Sting and RVD...Id say they were all faces then too. I could see the tweener argument but he still had the feud with bischoff (despite using Immortal a bit) and Id say he was face through the Sting/RVD feud, there wasnt really a heel in there, and Anderson was probably the most over at the time.
It wasnt until after that, when he started dressing up as Sting he sort of made a transition to being a heel (And started insulting the fans etc.) Id say he was still a face just because he wasnt "good" After all Stone Cold was never "good" but he was most certainly a face. Didnt stop him from stunnering everybody that moved though. When Triple H pedigreed Londrick for no reason at all he was still a face even if that was a "bad" thing to do. I think a tweener is more like Sheamus is now on SD, he's attacking Orton AND Christian and he really isnt meant to be alligned either way yet.
And when you say "your" anti-hero do you mean from your character or that you made up the term? <_<
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