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Post by jonnyomega on Dec 12, 2009 12:43:54 GMT -5
The best compromise for the Championship Committee would be for them to recommend one challenger per month and pitch them to the champion in advance so they can work their plans around the challenge.
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 12:47:27 GMT -5
Oh, please. The difference is that before when I was taking a break there was no consideration of closing ACW, and it seemed to be pretty steady while not up to its former self, it didnt seem ready to collapse any second. I didnt know that this lack of interest was happening. Had I known how bad things were, I would have come back sooner. The fact is, I didn't. Now, however, everybody knows. So while before I could have taken a break because ACW was stable, right now it isnt, so dont act like it's the same thing CP. Because right now, we can't take a break. Things weren't this bad a month ago and if they were nobody alerted me. No the difference is that it's inconvienient for you if people take a break and leave the fed with five members. As far as the fed being stable, no, not really, the ACW Team had already been brought up because Kenny and a few others knew we had already started down the slippery slope, and yet becuase things were fine at the moment, you didn't give a fuckin' rats ass about it. Now when things are really the same, we haven't lost any members since that time frame, we've actually gained members but some people are just getting worn down with work, school etc. or just tired of shit like this coming from you, trying to shift the blame off of yourself onto someone else. It happened with your Steele feud, it happens every week when you're late with your stuff, it's the reason I wrote just as much for your's and Senator's feud as you did. When it benefits you, you're Mr. ACW, but when it would benefit anyone else, you don't give a fuck. Now I aplogize for those who are watching, I know Flamingo and Mark are and are probably shaking there heads but this is the reason we've gotten to this point, people refusing to see that change is needed as opposed to just maintaining the status quo.
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 12:52:17 GMT -5
The best compromise for the Championship Committee would be for them to recommend one challenger per month and pitch them to the champion in advance so they can work their plans around the challenge. Then again you're running into the problem of champions taking slack defenses or keeping the title within a significant clique bu just rejecting the suggestion. I mean, if Rob, Dave and I wanted too, we could probably control the strap up to Omega Efffect, pass it off to Ken, Dave or I could, who then could in turn pass it to Mainer and by that time, Dave, Rob and I are right back in place to get the strap, we could basically keep everyone out of the title picture up until this point next year, or beyond with relative ease.
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Jason Freeman
Competition Judge
Long Island Iced Free
Posts: 3,271
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Post by Jason Freeman on Dec 12, 2009 12:53:39 GMT -5
I fail to understand how leaving the fed with five members is inconvenient to anybody, and how you can't draw the distinction between taking a break when the fed is stable, and while it seems to be a bit worse off than it was in its best days, still had a very decent roster and doing okay, and taking a break when the fed is so far down that it was considered closing.
Its okay to take a break, CP. However, at this moment it isnt, because right now they are considering closing the fed. So I dont understand why I cant attempt to get people to band together and do things now when the fed is in danger, even though I took a hiatus when the fed was stable. I really dont see anything wrong here.
Do I look at the fed now, where it is, and wish that I had been writing the past month? Sure. Every last person would have helped. However, one can't predict the future, and while I think "aw man I wish I had returned sooner" that doesnt mean that my choice was wrong under the circumstances. I didnt do anything wrong, CP.
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Post by BK London on Dec 12, 2009 13:10:02 GMT -5
So I think I'm just gonna take a raincheck on this whole chat thing until people can be diplomatic
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 13:14:35 GMT -5
Its okay to take a break, CP. However, at this moment it isnt, because right now they are considering closing the fed. Actually it is, if I want to take a break, if I don't want to write for ACW then that's fine, if I don't enjoy it here I'm free to take my services elsewhere, I'm not contracted here. Yes you took a break and we ragged on you and your free to do the same to us, but to say it isn't ok for us to do it isn't fair, despite problems Ken and I have with you we never said it wasn't your right to do so. We said it would be nice, it would be helpful if you stepped up and wrote the odd match or did some advertising. It would also give you a leg to stand on when you were bashing Kenny for trying to kill ACW, that you were trying to save it, but that was too much of an inconvenience for you, just like writing for some of us is now. So unless you're going to step up and pay us an hourly wage to write for this fed, to say we can't take a break, or withdraw from the fed is wrong, and honestly makes me not want to go to any effort to save this fed because I know it'll be on the hard work of AK, Senator, myself and others that it'll be saved but if we ask you to something you won't but will be more than ready to take any credit, saying "look at me, I brought us together, I'm a fuckin' Keebler elf."[/quote] Do I look at the fed now, where it is, and wish that I had been writing the past month? Sure. Every last person would have helped. However, one can't predict the future, and while I think "aw man I wish I had returned sooner" that doesnt mean that my choice was wrong under the circumstances. I didnt do anything wrong, CP. No, what was wrong was you bashing those who were trying to save this fed for trying to "kill it" when they were doing something to rectify it. Meanwhile you were sitting on your ass doing nothing when your fuckin' radio show with Rep did more to hurt this fed than Kenny leaving for SLA did. Kenny leaving cost us one member, Lee, we actually gained four when SLA closed if we had done something to keep them we would have been plus three members, but they jetted because of you're stupid fuckin' ass on the radio show making fun of everyone. That radio show empowered Rep, it's no surprise that alot of the problems, really, really started once he got going with it, sure he was critical of some people's work but at least he wasn't the bear OOC he became. YOU FREEMAN, but agreeing to co-host gave him the power to do what he did on that radio show that cost us in excess off ten members, and nearly closed down this fed. If Rep hadn't have been banned when he was, there was a group of eight people, Our World, and International Champions, as well as their number one contenders, ready to strike or at least walk away from the fed, killing it in one fell swoop, just like that. Yet you fail to see any damage you've done. My point still stands and you actually continue to prove it with each post that you are the most selfish person in this fed, riding other's coat tails to the top, having 9/10th's of the fed just not give a fuck about you, and only willing to aid ACW when it's convienient for you, and even then your "aid" is to bash someone who has offered to do something to really help ACW but is growing more and more disenchanted with it. You could be spending this time again, writing a match for the show, or advertising the fed. You could use the same argument for me, but I've already stated what it's going to take for me to stay involved. A concerted effort from two handfuls of people that are motivated to get this fed going. Now why don't you send me a PM, asking me for a link of some top sites to sign us up for. Get the image code for the ACW banner, and go and sign us up, keeping the embed links and then sending Senator/AK a PM, asking them to create a seperate forum at the bottom to put in all these embed links, then directing everyone to click them and vote for ACW.
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 13:16:07 GMT -5
So I think I'm just gonna take a raincheck on this whole chat thing until people can be diplomatic Oh I'm done BK, I think Freeman has done an apt job and proving my point this morning. I look forward to said chat on how to resolve these problems, or what to do on our final show.
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Post by Adrian Flamingo on Dec 12, 2009 13:20:17 GMT -5
Alright, 2 cents time. I am not totally against coming back to ACW for a length of time. I rp three characters at a more traditional e-fed so I know that I could handle doing a weekly couple of segments to ACW.
I left because I was tired of how stagnant it felt here. I was sick of the arguing, the bickering, and all of the "conspiracy" theories. Yeah, some of them were probably true, but it happens when people have a degree of power over others. However, I don't think its the rules or the structure of the show that needs changing, its the material that we pull from to write that does.
- I'd love to have the fed become more diverse. I'd like to see different types of gimmicks, different types of stories, and different types of writing styles. One reason I loved being here was how different it felt but I just don't get that vibe anymore. I recall everyone sort of doing a variation of the cool, cocky heel before leaving - no idea if thats changed now. I just logged in very recently.
- I'd like to see a more competitive title scene. Combine the Entertainment and International belts, call it something new, and make it different to make it special (IE: can only be defended in specific matches/weekly TV shows/or what have you).
- Introduce a Contender's system/ranking. The Champion can still feud with whomever they want, but there should also be an objective way of allowing others to challenge. A Contender's Cup/Trophy would be a trophy signifying that holder was eligible for a title shot, but he would have defend it like a belt until he used it. The strategy would be that the holder could either use it now and get his match or wait it out until they thought they were ready, but run the risk of losing it. Think of it as the Money in the Bank.
- I'd like to see the number of characters be allowed to be increased to two so that someone can come here as a tag team. Tag teams work easier if they are controlled by one person instead of having to rely on another.
- I'd like a change in show atmosphere. Simply put, I like the touring idea (more writing opportunities that can based on location) and a change in the NPCs (new commentators, new authority figure, and new interviewers).
We need a change in the status quo. Everything is on a life cycle and when it starts to slump, you do something different to give the product new life. Additionally, I'm not adverse to the mass reboot idea someone suggested earlier.
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Jason Freeman
Competition Judge
Long Island Iced Free
Posts: 3,271
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Post by Jason Freeman on Dec 12, 2009 13:23:39 GMT -5
I think you are putting way too much stock into the radio show. I mean nobody seemed to care at first. TK was on it numerous times. BK was on it. Mainer even agreed to go on it at the end. In fact at first everyone loved it. Dont you guys remember all the posts that were actually praising it? Didnt YOU make an advertisement for it for one of the shows. All of a sudden the radio show killed ACW, but TK leaving and creating another fed was what almost saved us? <_< I give up on you, CP.
That being said, perhaps I did word it wrong saying you have to write, what I meant was, despite the fact that I took a break when ACW was doing alright, does not mean I cant encourage others to write when ACW is close to closing. Leaving when I did was nothing wrong. At the moment ACW really is suffering, so at the moment this is a time when people should really band together and try to write matches. If you dont want to, fine.
And I dont think anything can excuse for TK's immature bitter attitude these past few days, from his posting the porky pig "Thats all folks" video, to basically posting random stuff in chat and other places, basically giving up on ACW, and spreading a negativity that is making others not care as well. So, yes, I can understand why he may have been disheartened, the way he reacted to it was ridiculous.
And BK, while this may be a disagreement, I dont think that Im saying anything out of line, that shouldnt be said. It isnt a flame war as far as I know.
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 13:34:32 GMT -5
Alright, 2 cents time. I am not totally against coming back to ACW for a length of time. I rp three characters at a more traditional e-fed so I know that I could handle doing a weekly couple of segments to ACW. I left because I was tired of how stagnant it felt here. I was sick of the arguing, the bickering, and all of the "conspiracy" theories. Yeah, some of them were probably true, but it happens when people have a degree of power over others. However, I don't think its the rules or the structure of the show that needs changing, its the material that we pull from to write that does. - I'd love to have the fed become more diverse. I'd like to see different types of gimmicks, different types of stories, and different types of writing styles. One reason I loved being here was how different it felt but I just don't get that vibe anymore. I recall everyone sort of doing a variation of the cool, cocky heel before leaving - no idea if thats changed now. I just logged in very recently. - I'd like to see a more competitive title scene. Combine the Entertainment and International belts, call it something new, and make it different to make it special (IE: can only be defended in specific matches/weekly TV shows/or what have you). - Introduce a Contender's system/ranking. The Champion can still feud with whomever they want, but there should also be an objective way of allowing others to challenge. A Contender's Cup/Trophy would be a trophy signifying that holder was eligible for a title shot, but he would have defend it like a belt until he used it. The strategy would be that the holder could either use it now and get his match or wait it out until they thought they were ready, but run the risk of losing it. Think of it as the Money in the Bank. - I'd like to see the number of characters be allowed to be increased to two so that someone can come here as a tag team. Tag teams work easier if they are controlled by one person instead of having to rely on another. - I'd like a change in show atmosphere. Simply put, I like the touring idea (more writing opportunities that can based on location) and a change in the NPCs (new commentators, new authority figure, and new interviewers). We need a change in the status quo. Everything is on a life cycle and when it starts to slump, you do something different to give the product new life. Additionally, I'm not adverse to the mass reboot idea someone suggested earlier. If Flamingo's in, I'm in. 'nuff said.
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Post by The Red Panther on Dec 12, 2009 13:42:12 GMT -5
FUCK YOU!!1111
*Cries*
Seriously though, I would be up for the chat. I will attempt to get some members on another board I visit later. Also, could everybody cool your fucking jets.
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Post by Alicia "Atomic" Kitsune on Dec 12, 2009 13:46:07 GMT -5
Right. I’d have posted last night if I hadn’t been out at the 02, watching Bill Bailey be the tremendous troll-like creature he is. ^_^. Anyway, I don’t want to make this a huge wall of text, so I’ll try to keep it under some sort of control.
First thing – this is not a topic in which bitching at one another is remotely helpful, so check your egos at the door, gents. I’m not interested in hearing yet again that person A hates person B. Go on AIM or whatever and sling mud if you’re that way inclined, please. (Freeman and CP, I’m staring the mod stare at both of you. HARD.)
Second thing I wanted to say was, whatever our issues are, whatever decisions need to be made, a fed which can generate a 100-post topic in under 48 hours is not one I’m inclined to read the last rights to. Even the people posting to say that their view is tending toward a shut-down obviously care enough to bother to come on and post that opinion. So my personal view is that it’s worth at least one more proper attempt to fashion a federation which works in the current climate.
In order to do that, I think that there are certain elements which we need to put in place. If we can’t fulfil these conditions satisfactorily, then I feel we have to admit that we don’t have sufficient resource to operate in an acceptable manner. These elements are as follows:
Additional moderator effort and support I was going to type “new mod(s)”, but as a lot of people have pointed out, just putting more mods into the mix isn’t going to solve anything. It seems clear from the early posts that Zero is no longer in a position where he feels able to be an active part of the mod team, and before anyone gets heated, that’s absolutely fine. Real life comes first, that’s always been our rule, and I remain grateful to Zero that he was prepared to give things a go, even if the role ultimately didn’t work out. I think that we do need at least one new person, and the main question in my mind is whether we have anyone who has sufficient time available to visit the boards most days and be able to answer queries quickly. The major issue we’ve had recently is that Senator, Jonny and I have all been very limited in the frequency of our visits to the boards; we’re checking in two or three times a week, and that’s evidently not enough.
I can only speak for myself, but my personal situation is that I’m now working longer hours than previously; the recession’s making business very trying, and I don’t think it’s a co-incidence that my time for ACW has fallen away to be replaced by more hours at my office PC instead. There is a limit to how much time I can spend in front of a screen, as a couple of you already know from chatting with me, over the last few years a real effect on my vision (which was never 20-20 in the first place) has occurred, and I’m having to be more careful than ever not to end up with eye strain. Couple this with the ever-present time difference, and it means that I have to accept that I can only do so much for ACW, whatever my preference might be.
Several names have come up as potential mods and I wouldn’t disagree with any of them; but neither can I say whether, realistically, they have the time available to be the kind of mod we need. I feel that this is the prime issue we need to determine – do we have one or more candidates who are willing and able to visit the boards daily, be the first point of contact, and to generally organise that information so that the other mods can see on the boards when they log in what issues need a full mod response? The amount of time per day isn’t excessive – half an hour most days would probably do it – but consistency is key. And it’s lack of consistency which seems to be at the root of everything.
Bring back the chats – For me, the chats have always been what makes ACW a cut above in terms of the social experience. Knowing that there’s going to be a good handful of people around at a certain time when the show’s on, to have a bit of “live” feedback and just generally mess about – for me that’s a perfect fit with our show system. It used to be that people would drop into chat even if they hadn’t written for a show; now, even people with matches on the card are regularly not turning up. I don’t know if it’s the Wednesday night show that’s the problem – it’s certainly less convenient for me than Thursdays or Mondays, but I’ve done my best to work with it since it seemed to be a majority’s preference. Regardless, even if people aren’t able to write so much, just having a more regular chat attendance would make us feel more bonded as a group. Chats don’t necessarily have to co-incide with shows, but somehow it makes more sense if they do, at least that’s how it seems to me.
Show posting help, anyone? I was initially in favour of the move to one show a week as I was hopeful that one or more people might be able to take on a show a month, or maybe even two shows, thus opening a little more time for me to write without having to worry about getting everyone else’s work together. That hasn’t happened, and I have to be totally honest – if there’s one thing which has de-motivated me personally, it’s a sense that I’m being just a tiny bit taken for granted. Just before we went to the one show a week system, I thought seriously about taking a break from responsibility for the shows, a couple of months maybe, so that I could do a bit of writing just for myself and recharge the ol’ batteries. With the system change, it became apparent that this simply wouldn’t be feasible, and that if I did decide just to say, “I’m off for a bit”, there wouldn’t be anyone else in a position to be able to step in. Don’t get me wrong, there’s no way I’m going to just walk away from ACW – but I can’t continue indefinitely without some sort of regular, organised help with posting duties.
I’ve just read that back, and realised it is in fact a wall of text. Darn. <_<
Anyway, I’ll shut up, except to say that I agree with either dropping the ranks or making them a non-factor in match results, and that I’d support a “clean reboot” if it’s considered the best way to regenerate enthusiasm. (I seem to recall there’s still a shedload of TNT under the arena which TK left there, though I’ve always liked our way of interspersing tours with periods at a defined home base). And challenger committees almost always end up being perceived as “cliques”, even if they’re nothing of the sort. We’ve managed for a long time without needing to tell champions how to develop their feuds and I’d be very cautious about going down that road.
I’ll drop by the chat at around 9pm UK if others are about.
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Post by Kim Jong CP on Dec 12, 2009 14:04:19 GMT -5
(Freeman and CP, I’m staring the mod stare at both of you. HARD.) Sorry do we have one or more candidates who are willing and able to visit the boards daily, be the first point of contact, and to generally organise that information so that the other mods can see on the boards when they log in what issues need a full mod response? The amount of time per day isn’t excessive – half an hour most days would probably do it – but consistency is key. And it’s lack of consistency which seems to be at the root of everything. I have the time to do something like this and would have no problem devoting the needed time if we're going to continue on with this. My only problem as is evidenced in this thread, and as Senator has pointed out before is that I am a hot head and very opinionated which might not be what we want as a moderator. I was initially in favour of the move to one show a week as I was hopeful that one or more people might be able to take on a show a month, or maybe even two shows, thus opening a little more time for me to write without having to worry about getting everyone else’s work together. I would have no problem in helping post shows if we can agree on a time change, at present time I'm in the middle of math class as the show goes up and don't get home until 6 PM EST on most days. If people would be ammiccable to an 8 PM EST show posting I would have no problem what so ever posting the shows whenever needed. I've enjoyed doing it the few times I have, but am often unable too with the time difference, much the same as we experience with the folks across the pond. I’ll drop by the chat at around 9pm UK if others are about. I'll be there.
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Post by worldbreaker on Dec 12, 2009 14:06:27 GMT -5
(I seem to recall there’s still a shedload of TNT under the arena which TK left there, though I’ve always liked our way of interspersing tours with periods at a defined home base) And baby, you know I have the detonator all ready to sing the sweet melodies of death. You just say the word and it's push the red button time!
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Taylor
Senatorial Stable
Posts: 255
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Post by Taylor on Dec 12, 2009 14:07:34 GMT -5
I think a complete reboot/rebranding would be the best move at this moment. I think it is safe to say that ACW isn't a patch on itself atm, and one of the reasons I think this is is because there is no sparkle anymore. I remember when I first joined in late 07 that the thing that drew me in was how different it was and just general atmosphere. The tight knit family impression that was given was certainly no small factor, either.
I think many good suggestions have been made in this topic, and I'd like to highlight the ones from Flamingo and whoever suggested we look further a field than just e-fed hubs. I think if mixed things up a bit then it will make ACW (or the rebranded ACW) much more interesting and attractive. It could also bring back old members. I also don't particularly feel we need to mould non-wrestling efed writers into to wrestling efed writers. This is ACW after all, we have had many writers where the wrestling aspect has not been their first thought.
The efed scene maybe dying in general but there's still enough life and interest to keep ACW running if people really want to. If we advertised as a 5 year old fed cleaning the slate and taking a slightly fresh approach I would bet we'd get a few members. People tend to join new feds rather than really old ones as they feel they can make an impact quicker.
Well, uh that's about it. I'll be in chat too at 9.
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